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Insightful take on Nairobi Real Estate
ombaalbt
#101 Posted : Thursday, November 08, 2018 7:40:55 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/19/2014
Posts: 19
Location: Migori
MugundaMan wrote:
wukan wrote:


Gosh! I wouldn't want to hangout with you at a cocktail, you can't move a conversation forwardPray I have to spell it out for you. I'm just posting stuff on the nairobi real estate as the title of this thread is "Insightful take on Nairobi Real Estate". Your insights on nairobi real estate are most welcome. If you have none then stick to dustbowl insights


You mean regarding the Kirinyaga Rd "luxury bedsitters?" Laughing out loudly
Who brought them up on this forum?
And isn't Kirinyaga rd in Nairobi and hence worthy of this discussion?



Congratulations @Mugundaman you just made the century post on the thread
Learning to sit on my hands
VituVingiSana
#102 Posted : Thursday, November 08, 2018 8:34:40 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 14,882
Location: Nairobi
whiteowl wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
whiteowl wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
Eagle Towers Kirinyaga Rd still has no takers (neither for rent nor for sale) so you guys DID NOT miss any opportunity whatsoever. You can still buy Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

https://firstavenueprope...-towers-kirinyaga-road/

5m for a very funny looking studio, 40-50k per month rental. Ask yourselves, who in their right minds would want to live there and pay 40k (service charge exclusive)? Even you yourselves if you are honest, you will admit you may buy for speculation but not to live there. Check back in 5 years..these same same studios will still be going for 5m or 40k rent with NO TAKERS even then! Unless Kirinyaga Rd turns into the Canary Wharf Tony Stark speaks of! Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly


Thika Arcade is one of biggest buildings in Thika CBD.During the 90's I used to think that the owner was very stupid for having such a huge building that was vacant past the first floor.Today it fetches 50k/month rent even for the top floors.In real estate,if the location is right you can only get burned by financing a project with short term credit.
How long was it vacant?


I dont have an exact timeline but it was quite a number of years during Moi era.When Kibaki took over,the economy took off and it started enjoying full occupancy and other taller buildings started coming up.
That was a long time to wait. It seems he did not finance it with loans. Thika Highway did open up the area. Good for him!
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Baratang
#103 Posted : Thursday, November 08, 2018 12:31:31 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/6/2009
Posts: 529
It appears real estate in Kenya is going haywire...

Kenya’s property market is sitting on sinking sand

@2012 noted seven pages of real estate auctions advertisement in a newspaper a while ago meaning that things are really thick...
Kate_Mbarire
#104 Posted : Thursday, November 08, 2018 10:14:13 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 9/4/2018
Posts: 51
Location: Nairobi
Baratang wrote:
It appears real estate in Kenya is going haywire...

Kenya’s property market is sitting on sinking sand

@2012 noted seven pages of real estate auctions advertisement in a newspaper a while ago meaning that things are really thick...

Hmmm interesting article
MugundaMan
#105 Posted : Friday, November 09, 2018 3:22:06 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 835
Location: Future Dustbowl Citizen
Baratang wrote:
It appears real estate in Kenya is going haywire...

Kenya’s property market is sitting on sinking sand

@2012 noted seven pages of real estate auctions advertisement in a newspaper a while ago meaning that things are really thick...


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

This guy is talking much yet saying a big round zero. Is he related to Lukorito Jones?
The guy does not even have a clue what he is talking about especially with regards to basic economics: supply and demand. He readily admits that the housing deficit is real, then argues in a very amateurish way (without providing concrete and verifiable figures) how that deficit is close to irrelevantLaughing out loudly. Then (like a very well known Wazoo personality) he paints growth as a "decline" because the rate of growth slowed a bit. That's like saying your shares in Centum "declined in value" because instead of rising from 28 to 35 like they did last year, they rose from 35 to 36! Total balderdash! Growth is growth!
I will tell him like I have told every other naysayer on Wazoo and beyond: WAKE US UP WHEN YOU REPEAL THE LAWS OF SUPPLY AND DEMAND NOT JUST IN KENYA BUT IN THE WHOLE WORLD. The commies tried and failed miserably. No force on earth can tame the supply vs demand dynamic. None! The sprawling Kenyan middle class is growing in both wealth, experience and expertise and is the prime source of domestic demand - the lifeblood of any economy worth its salt. This middle class is an almost virtually unlimited source of demand over its lifetime, meaning, if a middle class Kenyan is earning a decent income from his investments and/or payslip and has a house, it is only a matter of time before his savings have accumulated again to the point he can buy yet another house and/or invest in real estate allied businesses in a beautiful cycle that will only end at the grave. Remember Kenya has a paltry number of mortgages (which is a wonderful thing) meaning the sprawling middle class either buys cash or near cash (buys plots, builds slowly over time and repeats) meaning unlike other casino economies, the wealth of Kenya's middle classes is built painstakingly and securely over time which reduces micro-risk to almost zero for them.
"The best investment on earth is earth"
tony stark
#106 Posted : Friday, November 09, 2018 1:18:27 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/8/2008
Posts: 792
MugundaMan wrote:
Baratang wrote:
It appears real estate in Kenya is going haywire...

Kenya’s property market is sitting on sinking sand

@2012 noted seven pages of real estate auctions advertisement in a newspaper a while ago meaning that things are really thick...


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

This guy is talking much yet saying a big round zero. Is he related to Lukorito Jones?
The guy does not even have a clue what he is talking about especially with regards to basic economics: supply and demand. He readily admits that the housing deficit is real, then argues in a very amateurish way (without providing concrete and verifiable figures) how that deficit is close to irrelevantLaughing out loudly. Then (like a very well known Wazoo personality) he paints growth as a "decline" because the rate of growth slowed a bit. That's like saying your shares in Centum "declined in value" because instead of rising from 28 to 35 like they did last year, they rose from 35 to 36! Total balderdash! Growth is growth!
I will tell him like I have told every other naysayer on Wazoo and beyond: WAKE US UP WHEN YOU REPEAL THE LAWS OF SUPPLY AND DEMAND NOT JUST IN KENYA BUT IN THE WHOLE WORLD. The commies tried and failed miserably. No force on earth can tame the supply vs demand dynamic. None! The sprawling Kenyan middle class is growing in both wealth, experience and expertise and is the prime source of domestic demand - the lifeblood of any economy worth its salt. This middle class is an almost virtually unlimited source of demand over its lifetime, meaning, if a middle class Kenyan is earning a decent income from his investments and/or payslip and has a house, it is only a matter of time before his savings have accumulated again to the point he can buy yet another house and/or invest in real estate allied businesses in a beautiful cycle that will only end at the grave. Remember Kenya has a paltry number of mortgages (which is a wonderful thing) meaning the sprawling middle class either buys cash or near cash (buys plots, builds slowly over time and repeats) meaning unlike other casino economies, the wealth of Kenya's middle classes is built painstakingly and securely over time which reduces micro-risk to almost zero for them.


Ehhhh! Hyperbole much??
All forces of nature do not follow a supply and demand curve.
Also Governments everywhere do get rid of the laws of supply and demand in areas such as education health etc.
Wakanyugi
#107 Posted : Friday, November 09, 2018 5:15:51 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/3/2007
Posts: 1,489
tony stark wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
Baratang wrote:
It appears real estate in Kenya is going haywire...

Kenya’s property market is sitting on sinking sand

@2012 noted seven pages of real estate auctions advertisement in a newspaper a while ago meaning that things are really thick...


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

This guy is talking much yet saying a big round zero. Is he related to Lukorito Jones?
The guy does not even have a clue what he is talking about especially with regards to basic economics: supply and demand. He readily admits that the housing deficit is real, then argues in a very amateurish way (without providing concrete and verifiable figures) how that deficit is close to irrelevantLaughing out loudly. Then (like a very well known Wazoo personality) he paints growth as a "decline" because the rate of growth slowed a bit. That's like saying your shares in Centum "declined in value" because instead of rising from 28 to 35 like they did last year, they rose from 35 to 36! Total balderdash! Growth is growth!
I will tell him like I have told every other naysayer on Wazoo and beyond: WAKE US UP WHEN YOU REPEAL THE LAWS OF SUPPLY AND DEMAND NOT JUST IN KENYA BUT IN THE WHOLE WORLD. The commies tried and failed miserably. No force on earth can tame the supply vs demand dynamic. None! The sprawling Kenyan middle class is growing in both wealth, experience and expertise and is the prime source of domestic demand - the lifeblood of any economy worth its salt. This middle class is an almost virtually unlimited source of demand over its lifetime, meaning, if a middle class Kenyan is earning a decent income from his investments and/or payslip and has a house, it is only a matter of time before his savings have accumulated again to the point he can buy yet another house and/or invest in real estate allied businesses in a beautiful cycle that will only end at the grave. Remember Kenya has a paltry number of mortgages (which is a wonderful thing) meaning the sprawling middle class either buys cash or near cash (buys plots, builds slowly over time and repeats) meaning unlike other casino economies, the wealth of Kenya's middle classes is built painstakingly and securely over time which reduces micro-risk to almost zero for them.


Ehhhh! Hyperbole much??
All forces of nature do not follow a supply and demand curve.
Also Governments everywhere do get rid of the laws of supply and demand in areas such as education health etc.


Actually Mugunda has a point here.

I read the article and thought the author went a tad overboard with his doom mongering. But If you read many of his past articles they have been couched in the same 'sky is falling' hyperbole. Why? I don't know.

The recent contraction in the commercial and high end real estate, caused by overbuilding and unrealistic pricing of land and houses, is not evidence of burble burst. The real demand, Mugunda is right, is in the middle and low end, and that will not even be slaked by Uhurus 500K houses.

One more thing, collapses like the one of the US in 2008, are caused quite often by concentrated risk exposure, in that case the banks were exposed through subprime lending and opaque repackaging of loans. Kenyas real estate risk is dispersed and borne largely by Kenyan savers directly. Otherwise, with 20,000 mortgages, no banker loses sleep over a real estate sector collapse.

Pervasive consumption lending is another story of course, but the interest rate Cap has largely put an end to that foolishness.
"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
Kate_Mbarire
#108 Posted : Sunday, November 11, 2018 7:01:38 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 9/4/2018
Posts: 51
Location: Nairobi
Wukan. Is it Edermann that has been contracted by GOK under the affordable housing agenda now by SONKO to build a HIGE number of units in NGARA?Old Ngara?
wukan
#109 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2018 8:09:05 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 858
Kate_Mbarire wrote:
Wukan. Is it Edermann that has been contracted by GOK under the affordable housing agenda now by SONKO to build a HIGE number of units in NGARA?Old Ngara?


No Edermann is doing its development on its own private property. The affordable housing under sonko was Public private partnership commenced under kidero

Quote:
Under the plan, Kiewa Group Limited will spend Sh7 billion to redevelop the Old Ngara Estate, which will have 840 apartment units.

Jabavu Village Limited will build 1,470 apartments at Jevanjee Estate, opposite Kariokor Market at a sum of Sh9.1 billion while Sovereign Group Limited will develop 1,050 units at Pangani Estate for Sh7 billion.

KCB will put in Sh9 billion to build 1,050 units at the New Ngara Estate; Stanlib Kenya Limited will spend Sh3.7 billion to put up 1,050 apartment units at Uhuru Estate and Directline Assurance Limited will redevelop Suna Road Estate at a cost of Sh3.5 billion, which will comprise 1,050 units.
https://www.businessdail...3898-mru9cfz/index.html


This more of hadithi hadithi projects unlikely to take off any time soon. By the time the tenants fight it out in court it will be 5 years even before ground-breaking
Fyatu
#110 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2018 6:04:55 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/20/2011
Posts: 1,178
Location: Nakuru
wukan wrote:
Kate_Mbarire wrote:
Wukan. Is it Edermann that has been contracted by GOK under the affordable housing agenda now by SONKO to build a HIGE number of units in NGARA?Old Ngara?


No Edermann is doing its development on its own private property. The affordable housing under sonko was Public private partnership commenced under kidero

Quote:
Under the plan, Kiewa Group Limited will spend Sh7 billion to redevelop the Old Ngara Estate, which will have 840 apartment units.

Jabavu Village Limited will build 1,470 apartments at Jevanjee Estate, opposite Kariokor Market at a sum of Sh9.1 billion while Sovereign Group Limited will develop 1,050 units at Pangani Estate for Sh7 billion.

KCB will put in Sh9 billion to build 1,050 units at the New Ngara Estate; Stanlib Kenya Limited will spend Sh3.7 billion to put up 1,050 apartment units at Uhuru Estate and Directline Assurance Limited will redevelop Suna Road Estate at a cost of Sh3.5 billion, which will comprise 1,050 units.
https://www.businessdail...3898-mru9cfz/index.html


This more of hadithi hadithi projects unlikely to take off any time soon. By the time the tenants fight it out in court it will be 5 years even before ground-breaking


I wager my 25 by 50 plot in githurai that this affordable housing thing will never take off. Hapa tunanang'anywa mushahara by force. Hujuma!
Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
Fyatu
#111 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2018 6:07:55 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/20/2011
Posts: 1,178
Location: Nakuru
wukan wrote:
Kate_Mbarire wrote:
Wukan. Is it Edermann that has been contracted by GOK under the affordable housing agenda now by SONKO to build a HIGE number of units in NGARA?Old Ngara?


No Edermann is doing its development on its own private property. The affordable housing under sonko was Public private partnership commenced under kidero

Quote:
Under the plan, Kiewa Group Limited will spend Sh7 billion to redevelop the Old Ngara Estate, which will have 840 apartment units.

Jabavu Village Limited will build 1,470 apartments at Jevanjee Estate, opposite Kariokor Market at a sum of Sh9.1 billion while Sovereign Group Limited will develop 1,050 units at Pangani Estate for Sh7 billion.

KCB will put in Sh9 billion to build 1,050 units at the New Ngara Estate; Stanlib Kenya Limited will spend Sh3.7 billion to put up 1,050 apartment units at Uhuru Estate and Directline Assurance Limited will redevelop Suna Road Estate at a cost of Sh3.5 billion, which will comprise 1,050 units.
https://www.businessdail...3898-mru9cfz/index.html


This more of hadithi hadithi projects unlikely to take off any time soon. By the time the tenants fight it out in court it will be 5 years even before ground-breaking


When South Africans lament about state capture i wonder what they are talking about
Dumb money becomes dumb only when it listens to smart money
Kate_Mbarire
#112 Posted : Monday, November 12, 2018 6:39:23 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 9/4/2018
Posts: 51
Location: Nairobi
wukan wrote:
Kate_Mbarire wrote:
Wukan. Is it Edermann that has been contracted by GOK under the affordable housing agenda now by SONKO to build a HIGE number of units in NGARA?Old Ngara?


No Edermann is doing its development on its own private property. The affordable housing under sonko was Public private partnership commenced under kidero

Quote:
Under the plan, Kiewa Group Limited will spend Sh7 billion to redevelop the Old Ngara Estate, which will have 840 apartment units.

Jabavu Village Limited will build 1,470 apartments at Jevanjee Estate, opposite Kariokor Market at a sum of Sh9.1 billion while Sovereign Group Limited will develop 1,050 units at Pangani Estate for Sh7 billion.

KCB will put in Sh9 billion to build 1,050 units at the New Ngara Estate; Stanlib Kenya Limited will spend Sh3.7 billion to put up 1,050 apartment units at Uhuru Estate and Directline Assurance Limited will redevelop Suna Road Estate at a cost of Sh3.5 billion, which will comprise 1,050 units.
https://www.businessdail...3898-mru9cfz/index.html


This more of hadithi hadithi projects unlikely to take off any time soon. By the time the tenants fight it out in court it will be 5 years even before ground-breaking



Thank you Wukan AS ALWAYS.But I think this affordable housing will happen.thisnis Uhuru and his flagship project therefore he MUST see it's done because it's his legacy in his final term....
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