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JUBILEE HOLDINGS
Ericsson
#121 Posted : Friday, October 22, 2021 5:26:06 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,121
Location: NAIROBI
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952

What's the connection between Continental Re and Kenya Re?


If they want a bigger stake in a reinsurance firm and don't want a firm where Gok has control/calls the shots.
Isn't the point of investing to buy cheap and unlock value?


Yes,
You can also buy and have synergy with it for example directing their reinsurance business through a company they have a stake in to lock in the money or profits
That would simply be concentrating their risk that they would to reinsure. Why not keep buying Kenya Re which is cheap on a NAV basis vs paying full price for Continental Re?

Doesn't Jubilee have the option of not reinsuring with anyone (except for Kenya Re) if it wants to retain more of the premiums?


No they don't.
There are some business because of their value/worth a portion of it you have to reinsure with two or more reinsurers.
Jubilee isn't in charge of "General Business" (51% in Kenya sold to Allianz). The Life and Medical to be reinsured can easily be shared between Kenya Re and Allianz.


Not that easily as you have mentioned.
Allianz Kenya is an insurance company,so how does it reinsure
Yes, it is that easy. It's not rocket science.

Who said Jubilee should reinsure with Allianz KE?
Allianz (the partner and fellow shareholder) is a HUGE firm with a reinsurance arm https://www.allianzre.com/en_GB.html


If it's that easy,give example of such an arrangement that has been done locally.
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
My 2 cents
#122 Posted : Friday, October 22, 2021 7:01:30 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/2/2010
Posts: 718
Incidentally Kenya-Re's market share has been dropping. It is now at 16% of the Kenyan market. I wonder who is chipping away at their share.
Ericsson
#123 Posted : Friday, October 22, 2021 9:10:59 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,121
Location: NAIROBI
My 2 cents wrote:
Incidentally Kenya-Re's market share has been dropping. It is now at 16% of the Kenyan market. I wonder who is chipping away at their share.


East Africa Re
Continental Re
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
VituVingiSana
#124 Posted : Friday, October 22, 2021 11:53:07 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 17,667
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952

What's the connection between Continental Re and Kenya Re?


If they want a bigger stake in a reinsurance firm and don't want a firm where Gok has control/calls the shots.
Isn't the point of investing to buy cheap and unlock value?


Yes,
You can also buy and have synergy with it for example directing their reinsurance business through a company they have a stake in to lock in the money or profits
That would simply be concentrating their risk that they would to reinsure. Why not keep buying Kenya Re which is cheap on a NAV basis vs paying full price for Continental Re?

Doesn't Jubilee have the option of not reinsuring with anyone (except for Kenya Re) if it wants to retain more of the premiums?


No they don't.
There are some business because of their value/worth a portion of it you have to reinsure with two or more reinsurers.
Jubilee isn't in charge of "General Business" (51% in Kenya sold to Allianz). The Life and Medical to be reinsured can easily be shared between Kenya Re and Allianz.


Not that easily as you have mentioned.
Allianz Kenya is an insurance company,so how does it reinsure
Yes, it is that easy. It's not rocket science.

Who said Jubilee should reinsure with Allianz KE?
Allianz (the partner and fellow shareholder) is a HUGE firm with a reinsurance arm https://www.allianzre.com/en_GB.html


If it's that easy, give example of such an arrangement that has been done locally.
UAP
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Ericsson
#125 Posted : Saturday, October 23, 2021 8:49:01 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,121
Location: NAIROBI
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952

What's the connection between Continental Re and Kenya Re?


If they want a bigger stake in a reinsurance firm and don't want a firm where Gok has control/calls the shots.
Isn't the point of investing to buy cheap and unlock value?


Yes,
You can also buy and have synergy with it for example directing their reinsurance business through a company they have a stake in to lock in the money or profits
That would simply be concentrating their risk that they would to reinsure. Why not keep buying Kenya Re which is cheap on a NAV basis vs paying full price for Continental Re?

Doesn't Jubilee have the option of not reinsuring with anyone (except for Kenya Re) if it wants to retain more of the premiums?


No they don't.
There are some business because of their value/worth a portion of it you have to reinsure with two or more reinsurers.
Jubilee isn't in charge of "General Business" (51% in Kenya sold to Allianz). The Life and Medical to be reinsured can easily be shared between Kenya Re and Allianz.


Not that easily as you have mentioned.
Allianz Kenya is an insurance company,so how does it reinsure
Yes, it is that easy. It's not rocket science.

Who said Jubilee should reinsure with Allianz KE?
Allianz (the partner and fellow shareholder) is a HUGE firm with a reinsurance arm https://www.allianzre.com/en_GB.html


If it's that easy, give example of such an arrangement that has been done locally.
UAP


UAP reinsurance business is split between Kenya Re,Zep Re and Africa Re.
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
VituVingiSana
#126 Posted : Sunday, October 24, 2021 12:46:28 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 17,667
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952

What's the connection between Continental Re and Kenya Re?


If they want a bigger stake in a reinsurance firm and don't want a firm where Gok has control/calls the shots.
Isn't the point of investing to buy cheap and unlock value?


Yes,
You can also buy and have synergy with it for example directing their reinsurance business through a company they have a stake in to lock in the money or profits
That would simply be concentrating their risk that they would to reinsure. Why not keep buying Kenya Re which is cheap on a NAV basis vs paying full price for Continental Re?

Doesn't Jubilee have the option of not reinsuring with anyone (except for Kenya Re) if it wants to retain more of the premiums?


No they don't.
There are some business because of their value/worth a portion of it you have to reinsure with two or more reinsurers.
Jubilee isn't in charge of "General Business" (51% in Kenya sold to Allianz). The Life and Medical to be reinsured can easily be shared between Kenya Re and Allianz.


Not that easily as you have mentioned.
Allianz Kenya is an insurance company,so how does it reinsure
Yes, it is that easy. It's not rocket science.

Who said Jubilee should reinsure with Allianz KE?
Allianz (the partner and fellow shareholder) is a HUGE firm with a reinsurance arm https://www.allianzre.com/en_GB.html


If it's that easy, give example of such an arrangement that has been done locally.
UAP


UAP reinsurance business is split between Kenya Re,Zep Re and Africa Re.
Isn't there a requirement to use Zep Re just as one has to use Kenya Re?
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Ericsson
#127 Posted : Sunday, October 24, 2021 7:22:32 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,121
Location: NAIROBI
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952

What's the connection between Continental Re and Kenya Re?


If they want a bigger stake in a reinsurance firm and don't want a firm where Gok has control/calls the shots.
Isn't the point of investing to buy cheap and unlock value?


Yes,
You can also buy and have synergy with it for example directing their reinsurance business through a company they have a stake in to lock in the money or profits
That would simply be concentrating their risk that they would to reinsure. Why not keep buying Kenya Re which is cheap on a NAV basis vs paying full price for Continental Re?

Doesn't Jubilee have the option of not reinsuring with anyone (except for Kenya Re) if it wants to retain more of the premiums?


No they don't.
There are some business because of their value/worth a portion of it you have to reinsure with two or more reinsurers.
Jubilee isn't in charge of "General Business" (51% in Kenya sold to Allianz). The Life and Medical to be reinsured can easily be shared between Kenya Re and Allianz.


Not that easily as you have mentioned.
Allianz Kenya is an insurance company,so how does it reinsure
Yes, it is that easy. It's not rocket science.

Who said Jubilee should reinsure with Allianz KE?
Allianz (the partner and fellow shareholder) is a HUGE firm with a reinsurance arm https://www.allianzre.com/en_GB.html


If it's that easy, give example of such an arrangement that has been done locally.
UAP


UAP reinsurance business is split between Kenya Re,Zep Re and Africa Re.
Isn't there a requirement to use Zep Re just as one has to use Kenya Re?

Yes
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
Ericsson
#128 Posted : Tuesday, October 26, 2021 11:49:47 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 10,121
Location: NAIROBI
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
My 2 cents wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
[quote=My 2 cents]How do you know? Just answer in a straight forward manner.


Check the annual report of list of shareholders.
Check the latest and previous.
This is in their website

Great
2% but GoK has 60%. I hope JHL can buy 26% and get some board seats but GoK still calls the shots.

Board seats they need minimum 10%.
Do you have any source to back up that 10% can get them a board seat?

I know you said "minimum" but that means little in this context since GoK clearly has 50%+


If they want a bigger stake they could explore the other reinsurers such as Continental Re Kenya.
Britam years back expressed intention but little information is available on what happened.

https://www.businessdail...n-nigerian-firm-2055952[/quote]

Britam executed the transaction and owns 35% of Continental Re Kenya
Wealth is built through a relatively simple equation
Wealth=Income + Investments - Lifestyle
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